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When a second press is really a first press

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  • When a second press is really a first press

    Picture the scenario, you have your metalwork and labels, and one morning you press a handful of 7" records, you have a break for a cup of tea and press another 100, then have lunch and press another 500 in the afternoon.

    Next day you use the exact same metalwork and labels and press 500 more.

    Then next week another 500.

    Then next month another 500.

    Then next year another 500.

    And always with the same metalwork and labels.

    ALL the above should be perceived as 1st press, right? Not second press, not reissues.

    I'm trying to explain this to the folks at Discogs, but they just don't get it.
    http://www.jazzmanrecords.co.uk

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  • #2
    It all seems very logical to me .
    What's the problem then?
    Trying to list a release ?
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    • #3
      Originally posted by Jazzman Gerald View Post
      Then next year another 500.

      And always with the same metalwork and labels.

      ALL the above should be perceived as 1st press, right? Not second press, not reissues.
      Not reissues, of course. But you're pressing more a year later to satisfy demand? I can see why this would be thought as a repress.

      Is it possibly to distinguish the ones pressed a year apart from each other?
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      • #4
        I imagine a lot of people think that the process and gaps in time are a lot more obvious. As in, first press January, 1000 copies. Then 6 months later when the next 1000 are pressed, it's the second pressing.

        If you use the same stampers 6 months down the line, will there be any degradation compared to the original batch? If not, and the discs and sleeves are identical too, then no-one would be able to say it wasn't the first press. But people generally think the 1st pressing is desirable, which in terms of value, it seems to be, and also want the pressing that sounds best, which may or may not be the first batch pressed ...

        But if there's any difference in design, or the label has said that the 1st press would be 1000, then I guess there's a reasonable expectation on the part of the buyer that the number of 1st pressings won't increase.
        "White paper inner sleeve is pristine ..."

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        • #5
          Originally posted by eine View Post
          Is it possibly to distinguish the ones pressed a year apart from each other?
          No it's not, which is exactly my point
          http://www.jazzmanrecords.co.uk

          http://www.fatcity.co.uk

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          • #6
            For any set of stampers, when does degradation start to creep in?
            "White paper inner sleeve is pristine ..."

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Turboellis View Post
              For any set of stampers, when does degradation start to creep in?
              I know a guy who used to work at the EMI plant and he has said they should be changed (for quality control reasons) after 1,000 pressings but they would often press over 5,000 off the same stampers.

              The stampers are quite fragile so I'm not sure how well they'd cope with being moved on/off the pressing machines several times....
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              • #8
                its 'in print', like a book, but different print runs on in print books are considered different print runs, and are numbered. But I don't think that they can be considered reprints/ reissues, even if they are not all first editions. A second printing of a book is not republication, which should presumably be the test on a reissue.

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                • #9
                  I mean, think of how fine the gradations are on early Beatles records. But they never went out of print: the market organises around print run. It's meaningless trying to say that the second print run of Rubber Soul is a reissue

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                  • #10
                    If its the same metalwork same press, same cover, same matrix its a first press I don't see the issue. Francis is right its madness trying to distinguish presses I think I have a 7th according to discogs press of 'Dark Side of the Moon' distinguishable via the matrix but it was still pressed in the same year albeit it would have been different metalwork by then to satisfy demand. I gave up giving a monkeys about such things a long time a go as long as the pressing and mastering and source is good or as good as it can be in some cases I don't care.

                    To go all MOJO they repressed/remastered whatever they decide to call it Tulls 'Thick as a Brick' as part of Steven Wilson's 5.1 remix box set anyway something got screwed up in the mastering phase and they admitted as such. What do they then do a year later release it on its own using the exact same master.

                    Anyway what Jazzman is saying makes perfect logical sense.
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jazzman Gerald View Post
                      No it's not, which is exactly my point
                      HOT STAMPER / WHITE HOT STAMPER

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                      • #12
                        and your point is?
                        "White paper inner sleeve is pristine ..."

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